Marriage

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Comment by Cathy on November 19, 2009 at 8:45am

Spring:

It has been a long, hard battle to come to acceptance with going against the flow here in the Bible belt. The doctrines of misogyny that are taught in the church make me furious.

I have recently boiled it down to this: misogyny is essentially a hatred of weakness. We all have a hatred of our own helplessness and weakness to some degree. It's what proliferated slavery and it's what helps perpetuate subjugation of all peoples. Judgment, condemnation of other Christians, self-loathing, etc. It's all just hatred of our own humanity, our own weaknesses. It is SO hard to accept the gospel of wearing His yoke. We want to wear our own yoke and think the harder we work and labor, the better we'll get.

But I digress.

You were right about the article. But it's a good start for sure.

Spring, I loved your comments. Thank you for your compliment. I would like to sit down with you as well some time. I love discussing these topics because it is for freedom that Christ set us free. There is so much damage done to one whole HALF of the body of Christ by these archaic doctrines. UGH!

Comment by Spring on November 19, 2009 at 5:26am

Trisha: I am proud of you for rethinking your position of submitting to a controlling and dominant man.

I understand, I also feel guilty also taking time for myself and taking time to respond on this forum. We have our own business and there is so much to do. That seems so important because my husband and society etc. etc. hold that in high esteem. But reaching out to other women and providing emotional support for each other somehow seems selfish and I too have to remind myself this is furthering the kingdom of God which is Most important.

Isn't it interesting how Satan uses that soft spot in us to attack? But support from each other builds a strong wall against that attack. He can no longer pick us off one at a time.

Trisha you said,
"Is it really God's will to remain the doormat to his workaholism and continue to let the family suffer and just say, I will obey and trust God that things will work out while I live depressed and resentful. This is crazy."

Great question.

My husband is also a workaholic. We have made some progress in getting this contained but it has been a major project. It has taken over my life. I work at the business and have spent endless hours, days, and weeks trying make things more efficient so he would work less. Many times he would simply fill that time I opened up for him with more accounts, more favors for people, and more work. He has almost no boundaries. It has been insane. I have slowly, painfully made inroads.

As my husband's help meet I have brought this to his attention continuously and we have made some progress but not enough. This is still an area where I believe we are out of balance.

To answer your question, No, God does not want you to remain a doormat and simply wait for God to change your marriage. Those women are called "Standers". They stand by doing nothing hoping God will change their selfish childish husband's. 20 or 30 years later these women are fighting just to keep their sanity after Satan convinced them to waste 20 years of their lives by twisting God's word and often using the church to do it. Have you ever met any of these women who over time of living out this false doctrine become fake and weird?

God gave us intuition men don't come by naturally. THEY NEED US!!! Remind yourself of that. You know things your husband just does not get. Your husband is clueless!!!!

Yes, it’s hard work but it’s your job to bring these things to his attention that are on your heart and mind. Try two or three times doing it nicely and if he does not respond, turn up the drama. Introduce accountability.

For accountability I use a nationwide ministry. When my husband slides back into his old thinking and his own ways and he won't listen to me, I get him on phone mentoring calls through God Save My Marriage ministry.

http://www.godsavemymarriage.com/

Their forum address is
http://www.joelandkathy.com/boards/groupcp.php
You can try it out for free. It only cost me a donation of $10. a month. I actually donate more but almost any night of the week I can get on the calls and say, this is what is going on right now and if my husband is causing me pain by ignoring me, arguing with me, you name it, they will hold him accountable. It is the church working at its best,bringing stability to marriages and families. I also get to listen to other real people and their issues. It is great for husband’s to listen to because they begin to learn it’s not just their wives that feel that way, it’s most women.

I don't know if any other ministry offers this but I have never run across anything like it. You can even call the authors of the book and they take phone calls from new people to get them started in the right direction. Joel & Kathy really have a heart for marriages. And they are dedicated to what actually works in real life. They lived it out for years before they begin to teach it.

When I first got involved with this ministry about 9 months ago I thought, "Is this for real?" So much validation, so much help available day and night. Talk about an answer to prayer!

Cathy: What you wrote should be framed. Wish we could sit down over a cup of coffee and chat. I love your clarity and strength. You are very gifted. I love your explanation of the head meaning source. Exactly true. And if you read the whole context, the husband is to be the Source of Strength, Source of Life for his wife. I remind my husband of that frequently that he is my Source of Stregth, Source of Life. When he removes that from me it is as if he unplulgs me from the outlet and my energy drains, everything becomes difficult and draining and it bleeds into every area of my life. I desperately need him and sometimes I have to remind him he needs me.


Cathy, Love the Gary Wiens link and the comments people made to it are also good. He may be a little off on the submit part but the overall idea is priceless.
So good I'm going to quote part of it below:
“In most Christian marriages and in many Christian ministries that I’ve observed, the emphasis is not on laying down one’s life for the Beloved, but in getting the Beloved—the individual’s wife or the members of the congregation—to lay down their lives for the sake of the husband’s career or the corporate vision of the ministry. Rather than making the Bride the focus of ministry, leaders are adopting the value of having low-maintenance Brides that don’t get in the way of the vision being achieved. The emphasis is not on the leader or the husband laying down his life; it’s on the Bride laying down her life for the sake of the career or the ministry vision. It seems pretty backward to me! No wonder the wives or the church members have a difficult time submitting to the leaders! …

…true leadership in the image of Christ. Perhaps it’s time to begin to ask how we can walk this out in the crucible of our real relationships, and allow the chips to fall where they may with regard to the “success” of our careers or ministries. Who knows, maybe the Kingdom of God might come on the earth after all.”

Deborah, that is great that your husband practices being a good husband and listens to you and cares for your emotions. He clearly is not a husband that misuses the scriptures to control and dominate you. Your husband deserves a pat on the back.

Please understand the battle other women are in. With a domineering husband who is not laying his life down for his wife, the submit more and he will come around philosophy doesn’t work. It is cruel to put that burden on these hurting wives and promise them something that will not work.

The Bible does work, but we have to stop believing what other people tell us it means. We have to be careful that the true message is not lost in a bad interpretation, even the King James Version.

I love my Life Recovery Bible, the one New Life Live sales. The explanations at the bottom help put the meaning in an applicable context.

Trisha, you can come here for support. I want you to have a happy marriage where you are fulfilled and your husband cherishes you. The love and work you are putting into your children’s souls is the best investment you can make in eternity.

Not sure about the school thing while your children are small. Sometimes God gives us a drive and a dream that is not an end in itself but is the beginning of something new.

Comment by Cathy on November 17, 2009 at 12:09pm

Wow. I hear a lot of pain in this message. I am so sorry that you are hurting. I have also felt that pain!

Here is my take on all of it: the two become one. Neither is above the other. In fact, some authors (like the Eldredges in Captivating) make the case that, if anything, the woman is the pinnacle of God's creation: His masterpiece, containing all of the emotion and beauty of the Lord. That still doesn't mean that she is higher than the man, though. Or that he is higher than her. Together, they make up the beautiful symbol of who God is: strength and love. Paul tells us that marriage is a mystery: that together, we represent Christ and his bride.

Neither of us is above nor below but joined as one, side by side, walking it out. The Captivating definition of "help meet" is glorious. They break it down in the Hebrew and it basically translates as "life-saving partner."

That being said, you and your husband made babies. Someone has to work to feed them. (Usually that is the man because women tend to be better nurturers. But I have Christian friends who have reversed this role and I don't see them as "out of God's will.") If it is your decision together that he should work, that's great. Should his work interfere with family life? Should he not be present with his kids? Of course not! Because while we are called to work, we are also called to be parents (both of us). The tragedy with our culture is that parents and children no longer live and work side by side during the days. Dads now go away to work (versus farming or other at-home industry) and leave their families home. Usually Moms are left home as well, sometimes lonely, sometimes not.

I, too, homeschool my children and I also want to eventually go back to school and earn my master's and maybe teach college level classes. But right now, my children are so young that I wouldn't feel right about putting them in school. I have a lot of homeschooling mom friends who are starting to go back to school now that their children are more self-motivated with their studies. It's hard but it can work. I think you both need to figure out what is best for the children. Sometimes having a Mom who takes a break and goes back to school makes Mom happier and is good for the children! Sometimes that teaches them to take care of themselves and not burn out on just giving all the time.

I would say that it is probably not God's will for your husband to unnecessarily work. To provide food and shelter, yes. To work more than makes his family happy, no. It seems to me like you have been sacrificing everything for your husband and are just plain tired of it. Surely he has been sacrificing for you as well but it sounds like it's not really meeting your needs as a wife.

I think it's great if women choose to lay down their whole lives for their families because they feel they are doing it for the Lord (I mean, that he has specifically spoken to you about it and has given you the motivation in your heart to do it). That is right motivation. However, if you are simply doing it because you "should" or are "supposed to," that's not gonna last very long. That motivation will slip away and you'll be left feeling like...well, like you do right now. I have felt that way too. Now I am in the process of seeking God himself about what he would have me do. The voices of other Christian women's "shoulds" have been silenced. There is no voice but my Lord's. He may bring me to the place of sacrificing more for my family. But it will be HIM working in me, not some self-righteous, "good Christian Mom" act on my part that brings it about. Then, there will be nothing and no one to rebel against because the choice will be mine. I will not have been coerced, forced, or otherwise manipulated into doing what is "right."

It sounds like you are going through this as well. Figuring out that perhaps BOTH of you should be equally laying down your lives, submitting, sacrificing. And you are no longer willing to be the only one doing it. Many women would tell you to let God handle it, to pray, and trust Him to deal with your husband. I am not of that mind set. I think it is our responsibility as wives to draw loving boundaries and encourage our spouses to do what is best for our families. This is true for men, too, by the way.

This article was one of the first things I read regarding leadership and submission that really shook me up. Please read it as I think it really lends some perspective on the whole topic: http://www.burningheartministries.com/Articles/1000010792/Burning_Heart_Ministries/News/LEADERSHIP_IN_THE.aspx

I seem to be rambling on. Sorry. Patricia, you may need to ask God to help you begin clearing all of those "shoulds" out of your head too. I had to stop reading the Bible for almost a year because I couldn't quit reading it from an "I should do this" perspective. My counselor finally helped me surrender my will over to the Lord and trust Him to lead me and guide me into what I "should" do instead of trying to do everyone else's definition.

The Holy Spirit is faithful to us, to teach us these things!

Oh, I want to say one more thing about co-leading as a couple. Some people protest, "Sure Christ is the head of the home but someone has to be in charge and make the final decision." I think we are surrounded by examples where this is untrue. People learn to work things out, and make joint or corporate decisions all the time. One friend put it well, "Never make a major decision if you cannot agree." It's not worth subjugating one person under the other just to make a decision. :o)

Comment by trisha on November 17, 2009 at 11:16am

Ok
I've just read the last few entries concerning the age old male dominant view. And this very issue has been the heart of just what I'm going through in my life. I've always believed as a wife I was Just to give in to my hubby's demands that was the right, submissive and peaceful thing to do. That is what is biblical right?
Thirteen years of being married to a controling and dominant man has left me with lots of anger and resentment. I totally accepted the fact that as a wife and mother my wants and needs were to always come last and taking care of my self was just selfish. Even though today I know better I often still feel like I am plagued with quilt when I do go for a ride, or take the time to respond here or do anything for my self . It's like satan is whispering those shame and guilt lies constantly even though I have supposedly grown away from this . it's still a battle. I guess it's that co-dependancy tendancy. I still feel like I have to beg my hubby when I wnat to make a decision for my self.
now here is the big one I am facing today. I very much want to go back and finish school. My husband thinks no, no way. I am being selfish and not thinking of the needs of the family. There is no way are family can handle it. I renesent this because I feel like what he really means is there is no way I cna keep living my crazy work bured away from home life while you do this. He knows if I do this it will entail some of his help.
My feeling is that I've been home all along and I have homeschool the boys up unil this point. I desperately want to get out to work. Go do what it is I am called to do.
He has comnpletely neglected emotional needs of the children and I . If I do this he is going to have to assume some of the responsibility of being home at night with the kids. Maybe even make his own dr. appointments and make one of his own lunches.
Is it wrong for my to say hey I want to do this. Besides I am so so tired of being the only parent. His dream was to become a successful bussiness owner. The kids and I have sacrificed much for that to happen. I would like to persue some of my dreams. Sadly I feel if I am every going to get out ogf this house and go back to school I will also have to go to work and still cover everything, because He won't. And how can I ever justify doing this against his will.
Having said that I certainly believe in the male leadership as the final anwer at the end of the day . I just don't know how to macke sence of it all. Is it really God willto remain the doormat to his workaholism and continue to let the fam suffer and just say. I will obey and trust God that things will work out while I live depressed and resentful. THis is crazy.
Awhile back I was listening to focus on the Family and they were interviewing the authors of a popular christian marriage book (Love and Respect ) .
Anyways during the conversion the wife gave a testimaony to how she knoew that her husband would only truely be happy in the ministry and she spoke in details of the many years sacrifices she made in order for him to be happy in his work. His career was held in high esteem . She put all her dreams on hold for him and they are both very happy and he is a very accomplished marraige family auther and minister. Dr. Dobson just so openly praised this women for unrelenting love and sacrificein a way that made me feel like it's the womenns role ton cadrifice for her man . We are to be there support and helper. Something inside of me says wait I am fully human to with my dreams . Whey is there this male dominant thinking that there goals should always be placed first.
patricia

Comment by Cathy on November 13, 2009 at 7:57pm

Deborah:

I think it's great that you and your husband have found what works for you guys!! Many couples have also found that that particular paradigm works well for them. Usually it's when both partners are loving and caring naturally. You are right that Christ is the head of your home! Go you!

It's important for all of us to be aware that there are different ways that we make our marriages work and that there is no "one size fits all" solution.

I do get a twitch when I hear people misconstruing certain Bible verses, though. Particularly if they are preaching it from a pulpit. As believers, we are to study to show ourselves approved. Study is something that requires time and reading a bunch of extra-biblical commentaries, dictionaries, etc. It's very different from devotional reading. ALL Christians should be students of the word so that they might watch out for false doctrines. Gordon Fee has a wonderful book which is used in most seminaries called "How to Read the Bible for All It's Worth." It very simply and quickly teaches Christians how to properly exegete (extract meaning from) the Word without falling into proof-texting or other errors. (Proof-texting is when we pull a scripture out of context to "prove" the doctrine we want to uphold. It's what most pastors do every Sunday morning. They'll jump to the Old Testament, then to a gospel, then to an epistle, etc. pulling a verse or two out of each book to emphasize whatever point they're trying to make. Some people call this a "topical Bible study." It's just a bad habit and can be very dangerous.)

Anyway, I digress. I appreciate the iron sharpening iron benefits of this forum and am grateful for my brothers and sisters in Christ who have different paths but the same destination!

Comment by Deborah R. Phillips on November 13, 2009 at 3:53pm

Wow... sounds like you both have put quite a twist on the standard most Christian churches teach. Quite radical indeed. When I first read all this stuff, I must admit I was very unsettled and confused. It just seems so adverse to what Ive been taught all my life by my parents, teachers, pastors, counselors,,,, well, pretty much everyone. Of course when that happens, my first reaction is to take it to the Lord in prayer. He just has a way of settling my mind and giving me peace... our relationship is just like that and Im so grateful. Anyway,,, Im not in a position where I can debate this issue one way or the other. All I can testify is what has worked for me and I gotta say,,, maybe Im just very blessed to find that the old standard has passed the test in our family. Christ is the center focus in our home, my husband and I are partners in a growing relationship. We love each other and respect each other and, though we both have our own strengths and weaknesses, somehow it all balances out. We dont really have to demand anything from each other. If we have a need,,, we talk about it and out of love, we give without reservation. OK, Im not saying we dont have our arguments or our bad days..... we are, after all, human. But when things get tough, we take it to God....... together!!! Npw, my husband does have the final authority, under God's direction, for any major decisions and actually, Im quite comfortable with that. Not because I lack confidence or ability to lead........ it just doesnt feel natural for me whereas it does to him. He doesnt RULE me...... he leads in a way that is gentle and not forceful. I dont have to make demands or produce some kind of drama or threaten or berate or anything like that. I understand that a lot of women have to do these things and it breaks my heart. Men and women are created differently so that we can fulfill different roles in the whole family scenario which was created by God. It does seem He should be the one to tell us how things would work best. What I read in Scripture..... well,,,,,, the interpretation is different from yours. I feel unsettled because I know God is not the author of confusion....... Satan is! And He did say there would be a lot of deception in the last days. He said there would be many false teachers who will take the Scriptures apart and out of context and make them say things that are completely untrue,,,, so I guess, knowing those days are definitly here, we all best be on our guard and walking closely with our Savior so we arent deceived. I pray Jesus comes quickly because it seems the family,,, marriages,,, well, it all seems to be falling apart faster than ever before. Its almost like the more resources pour into society, the more confused and mixed up things get and the more heartache and broken homes result and our children become more lost than ever as to how to make it better. All we can do is pray,,, and keep our focus on Him.

Comment by Cathy on November 13, 2009 at 12:21pm

The brain book I'm reading is by Dr. Amen. I saw him on PBS talking about how brain chemistry really, really affects our personality issues, behavioral issues, etc. I have known for some time that I have a genetic tendency to certain mood disorders like depression, anxiety, failure to control impulses, etc. I've found certain things to help my mood (like exercise) but am looking into what he says more. I like it because he offers a non-medication approach to try to correct the brain before you start taking medication. It's going really well. I read a few chapters last night and was really "wowed" by how much I could relate to the issues. It's not all hormonal or psychological. Sometimes it's a combination of all.

Anywho, I just read a great book by Gene Edwards titled "The Christian Woman Set Free." It details the history of misogyny (hatred of women) throughout Greek philosophy and into the Christian church. For those who think that we have "arrived" and that woman-hating is dead, I know from personal experience that it is alive and well, particularly in the church.

In May my husband and I got kicked out of our church mostly because I am not willing to be a doormat wife (and he was not willing to strong-arm me into doing his will). The things our pastor said to us/me were horrifying and almost perfectly echoed the pagan philosopher Plato when he spoke about how men have to think for women because we are too irrational.

The Word of God has been so misused and maligned. It's insane. Until you understand the woman-hating culture that Jesus walked into, you cannot fully understand how radical and woman-LOVING he was. We also need to read all the NT verses on womanhood in light of the fact that most women were subjugated and ridiculed. Paul was bringing freedom to women in the cultural context that they were in at the time. I highly recommend the Edwards book for those who want to examine each scripture in light of the cultural context. There are a few scriptures that I didn't feel got enough treatment and weren't fully exegeted but I am fully capable of doing that on my own (cuz, hey, I can think for myself!).

Spring, I highly appreciate your insertion of the ACTUAL Greek in this thread. There is so much confusion on this topic. If you go to biblecc, you can look up the Greek for yourself at any time and a wonderful thing happens: you begin to see the actual meaning instead of misogynistic interpretations.

Most people do not know that Phoebe was a minister of the gospel. The same Greek word that is used for her is also used for Paul.

Most people are not aware that chapter and verse divisions have greatly strangulated our understanding of certain passages, especially Ephesians 5 where verse 21 was separated from the full thought AT RANDOM by a man on horseback a few hundred years ago. When read in this context, the term "submit" means something totally different! If the term "submit" means "obey," then ALL Christians are to obey one another at all times! Of course we know that's silly. A better interpretation would be "defer to." This is obviously voluntary and cannot, therefore, be made a law. It's a choice. It's freedom. Furthermore, BOTH husbands and wives (and all Christians) are told to submit to one another. The husbands just have to be specifically told HOW to submit because they might not be able to think on their own. J/K. I really respect the men of the world! When Paul tells husbands to "love your wives," he is explaining how to "submit to one another." It's one concept, one stream of thought.

Also, many people think that the Bible teaches that "head" means "authority over." So when the Bible says that the man is the "head" of his wife, does it mean he is in authority over her? NO! The Greek term "head" actually means "source." Don't believe me? Well, then think about how it can be that God is the "authority over" Jesus? Doesn't that sort of mess up our trinity doctrine where there is a triune God, equal in all parts? Or what about Jesus being "in authority over" us? Does that mean that he forces us to do his will? Of course not. He leaves us free will. So even if you don't believe that "head" means "source," (remember, Eve was taken from Adam), you can at least see that it doesn't mean "controlling, demanding, forceful."

I like what Jesus said about marriage in Matthew 19:

3Some Pharisees came to him to test him. They asked, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any and every reason?"

4"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'5 and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? 6 So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

7"Why then," they asked, "did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?"

8 Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning.

Jesus is saying some radical stuff here. First, he is saying that some of the laws were given because people's hearts were hard! He is saying, "Look, this is not really God's plan. He just made a provision for you guys who were jerks!" (My paraphrase). So we MUST remember this when we read the laws of the OT. I'm just glad the law of God is written on my heart!

Secondly, he is hearkening back to oneness--to one flesh. He is saying that the two become one. How then, can one "rule over" the other one? This is the same question we asked above about the trinity? How can one part rule over another? Simply not possible.

So that's my primer on biblical marital roles. I will say, from personal experience, that the law of love is the highest law for both men and women. Just like U2 said. :o)

Comment by Spring on November 12, 2009 at 11:01am

Cathy: I think I’ll get the brain book too.

For anyone unfamiliar with the New Testament concept of Mutual Submission:
The concept of male privilege is cultural not New Testament. I Timothy 5:14 for example talks about the woman being the head of a family. Same Greek word, "oikodespoteo". King James tries to be safe by using the interpretation "guide the house" or manage the house but it is the same Greek word used other places for head of the house. Yes, the husband is also referred to as “oikodespoteo” head of the house. Both husband and wife are referred to in the Bible as the head of the house.

Just because it refers to the woman as the head of the house does not mean she is the only head of the house. Likewise, just because it refers to the husband as head of the house, does not mean he is the only head of the house. I’m pretty sure it never refers to the children as head or ruler of the house although based on how Americans raise their children it makes you wonder if we don’t have that one confused as well.

This does not mean husband and wife rule over each other arguing about who has the final authority. No, they work as a team, collaborating. The New Testament says submit yourselves one to another. The Bible is not into giving husbands control over wives. Many husbands have a tendency toward being control freaks anyway. What recourse does a woman have if she is to submit regardless? Many women live in a state of fear and emotional, physical, and/ or spiritual abuse because of these wrong teachings.

Let's be the safe place of sisterhood for these women needing the support and courage to stand up to husband’s who want what they want when they want it and how they want it. Telling them that their husbands are the final authority is condemning them to a miserable life of depression and slavery. Who is going to correct these husbands who think they’ve got all the answers?

Put it to the test. Who makes better, more Godly decisions, a couple working as a team or a couple where the man considers himself the final authority? The proof is in the pudding. My husband used to think his brain was better than mine therefore he got to make all the decisions. God had to show him differently but he often used me as a part of showing him differently. If I had just stood by and waited for him to get it directly from God and maybe God was waiting for me to do my part, we could have had a lifetime of waiting. God and I worked on that one together and my part was definitely not to do nothing.

Women have a right to be happy, to have their thoughts and feelings treated with love and tenderness. Most women have brains. Teamwork takes advantage of strengths of everyone. Dictatorships feed self-centeredness and offers no checks and balances.

God does not set up a hierarchy where men rule and are accountable to no one. Dictatorship is dangerous. Even your church has a board of directors. A church where the pastor answers to no one and is the final authority would quickly lead to problems in the church. No one person is God. Husband, pastor, male, female. That is why God gave us checks and balances. That is why God gave husbands wives and visa versa. Yes, only Jesus, God, the Holy Spirit are the final authority and no one has the corner on that just because they were born male.

Good marriages work as a team. If one person feels more strongly about a decision than the other, go with it. My husband is better at business decisions than me but I am better at management and training. He had to learn the hard way because he thought he was better at everything.

My husband has an extremely high IQ and he thought he had married down but men marry at their own level.

Comment by Cathy on November 12, 2009 at 8:23am

Deborah:

I'm about to start reading a book on the human brain instead of a marriage book!

You and I have a different theology on the marriage paradigm. I see it as a partnership. I don't think that Christ will be held responsible for what we do as people and I don't think my husband will be held responsible for what I do, either. But it's certainly good to disagree at times!

My friend and I were lamenting this morning that all of us seem to just be set adrift....husbands and wives. We all have an ideal in our minds (I mean in our generation). We want to do things better than our parents, we want to "get it right" but we are clueless as to what that looks like. Perhaps that isn't supposed to be the goal...but what is???

We need the Holy Spirit for sure. Trying to obey what someone else is telling you about the Bible or how they think you should be married usually just ends up in condemnation and guilt. We need, need, need the Lord to speak to us in this area for sure! Help, Jesus!!! Help!!!

Comment by Deborah R. Phillips on November 12, 2009 at 6:47am

I think Im gonna take a break from self help books for awhile. Im blessed right now because my husband and I seem to be able to work things out between us without them. We applied some basic principles and well,,,, its working for us. Praise God! I know there are plenty of folks that need more than just basics to obtain peace so I do understand the need for those kind of resources. Its just that sometimes I think we have to figure things out for ourselves (with the Spirit's help, of course) and see what might work for our own particular situation and with our own unique personalities.
OK,,,, of course Jesus is the final authority over ALL things... I just meant between the husband and wife... the husband will be the one held accountable by the Lord about what happens in the home so he should be the final authority between the two. I just dont think it was a culture thing or a period of time thing. I really do believe its how God intended it to be... bottom line. I do think women today have more insight and wisdom due to higher education and work experience and, as a result, have more to offer when theres a decision to be made and so deserve that kind of respect.... but still,,,, I just think the husband, as head of the household, should have the final say and the ultimate responsibility for the decision made. I guess we could all go round and round on this... but we have to let God direct us,,, convict our hearts,,, allow the Spirit to interpret the Word... and go from there. Maybe thats why Im backing away from the self help craze. Those books tend to drown out that wonderful "still small voice".

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